In DEATH TO PIGS Hendrickson makes a side remark at one point that a shitload of hippy bodies would show up every week in places like Topanga Canyon, to the point where people began to get annoyed.
This triggered a major thing that always bothered me about TLB. Is it possible, that right UP TO TLB, the cops didn't give a shit?
1- Zero clearly is murdered and the cops, by all reports, accept the bullshit Russian Roulette with a loaded gun excuse.
2- Crowe is shot and obviously had to go to the hospital, but you don't hear anything about an extensive investigation.
3- The other murders that Buglisoi tries to pin on the Family, like the Scientology students and Joel Pugh- does it feel to any of you like these were priorities for law enforcement?
4- Even Gary Hinman, which today would be first page news, doesn't feel like that big a deal. I mean, if they had properly investigated it they would have by DAY TWO tracked down Mary Brunner who used to live there for god's sake and had some idea. They only got a suspect because stupid Bobby slept in a stolen car.
It just feels like a few deaths were no big deal to the cops. Until the movie star got it in the stomach.
Some if this stuff happen today and there is NO WAY nothing happens.
19 comments:
I've also thought about that from time to time. (even after TLB with the cops attitude when Steven Weiss's found the gun in the back yard). On the other hand...stolen cars!!! That's a different story!
Maybe things haven't changed so much as you say, Col. The Grim Sleeper was fairly big news but the cops weren't sweating it so much, it seems, as the victims were poor and black.
Not sure they'd have been able to track Mother Mary so easily anyway, even if they thought looking for a previous occupant was worthwhile. Depends what name she used at any given time as to whether they'd have found her.
A Hollywood star getting killed has obvious implications as far as LE agencies publicly displaying that they "give a shit". It puts them four-square in the spotlight. The brass would have to face the press. The local big tax-revenue movie industry would have to be made to feel safe in their homes.
Crowe should have snitched on CM. This criminals' code of not snitching is BS. Most of them snitch if they're facing a long stretch. Maybe he should carry some of the blame for TLB.
Ummm, just wondering, has anyone here been able to acquire the John Philip Haught autopsy report or is it still MIA?
Good observation. Seems to me like the cops in 1969 California were overwhelmed. Murders with no obvious motive are tough to solve. A young person is usually not married, and does not have business relationships that can lead to the murderer. With all the runaway yoots wandering around, with no traditional connections in the community, not surprising that the police could not solve them.
The celebrity aspect of these murders definitely made a difference... but also, the victims were killled in home invasions, which generally scare the crap out of people because where else can you feel safe?
Reading HS one has to wonder how much LE "gave a shit about" Tate/LaBianca.
It wasn't just shoddy police work, it was incredibly unprofessional.
When Sergeant Jess Buckles ignored Whiteley and Guenther's case breaking information supplied the day after the murders, a trend was born.
It was almost as if they weren't even trying to solve the crimes.
As Bugliosi pointed out, LAPD dropped the ball over and over again.
The way LE blundered its way through the high profile TLB murders.......one can only imagine how lame they were with low profile cases.
With all the runaway yoots wandering around, with no traditional connections in the community, not surprising that the police could not solve them.
Very true.In the late 60s half the young people bumming around the West Coast had come west from every other State looking for dope, cats/chicks and moosic (and some Californian sunshine).
I was in and out of LA, Frisco and Monterey (Big Sur) in parts of 1968 and 1969 and my memory is that hardly any of the kids I hung out with were from CA. Given that diaspora the cops would have had very few of these kids on file and given their life style (turned on, tuned in and dropped out) - and penchant for multiple identities - I think in those pre-computer days the cops would have had a hard time finding people, even if they had wanted to.
FrankM
to add to this great point...
how many times were different members of the family and there associates picked up for one reason or another?
stealing, drugs, being underage, indecent exposure, credit card fraud,possession of vehicle parts- the list of charges in incredible over the course of there times....
none of them ever faced any real consequences- even while on probation in some cases????
Well, Saint, I think we can apply that logic to all of society from the 1960s to today. Not to minimize what THEY were doing in 68-69, but things are so much more hypersensitive now. Back then for example, if you're caught with a 6 pack of beer in the car, you're told to go home and "not to let us see you again tonight." Today, you're hauled in, given a breathalizer, and face several thousand dollars worth of fines and legal costs.
Underage? Today, it's just another excuse to get somebody for zero-tolerance alcohol consumption and fines. Get the picture? Back then, you didn't have the organized pressure groups (MADD) and legal-eagle insurance/lawsuit people running around as much.
Not that I oppose them...just pointing it out.
That's a good point as well
But still...
charlie (for example)
was on parole- then was picked up for stealing, drugs, possession of various illegal things ( including underage runaways) etc etc... several times - not just once or twice- but many times... and still kept walking over and over...
That's a little different from getting caught with a few beers down by the lake...
No?
This is where the 'Charlie was an undercover plant from US Intelligence" theory comes from.
Yeah, but that's BS. The cops just plain sucked it big time oput there in Cali.
It's Friday afternoon here in the east. Hoping the Col was going to post...
Hi St. Circumstance, i've thought that same thing many times. For someone on parole from federal prison he had no job, no residence other than a roving bus or squatting on someone else's property, hanging with people that may have had criminal history, the drugs, the weapons, the underage girls, the stolen vehicle parts etc etc.
Hey Marliese :)
I am not one of those who believe in conspiracy theories, or MKultra or any of that stuff...
But it just doesn't make much sense the way these people kept doing the same things, and kept getting arrested, and that so many of them just kept going in and out of jail...
like a revolving door...
And as pointed out- even the very serious crimes- seemed no big deal...
until one happened they couldn't ignore...
think what it took..
And just think St. Circumstance, when the cops finally did raid Spahn Ranch, there was some sort of clerical error with the search warrant. They had helicopters but didn't have routine paperwork in order.
this ties in with the theory manson was left on the streets because the police and higher ups thought he was going to attack the black panthers.
I doubt very much Zero was murderd. It isnt too hard to put the pieces together:Sadie told Ronnie Howard that Zero had shot himself "holding the hand" of country sue and "climaxed all over himself;
Ronnie later said Sadie told her a story about fucking a guy who wanted to die at the moment of climax and drinking the blood running down her throat;
Ronnie was known to have less than perfect recall when it came to names and events, mixing up Charleses Watson and Manson;
As she called Susan Sadie, maybe she conflated "Susan Atkins" with "Country Sue";
Sadie also liked to take on other ppl's actions, cf, killing Sharon and Gary, so why not gradually claim the Zero story for herself and her bragging, especially since she does share the name of the actual girl involved;
In Hendrickson's movie, when Ronnie begins to tell that story, there is a fast aside to Paul Watkins, who says "that's Christopher Jesus you're talking about", another name for Zero;
However, on reading Death To Pigs, I find that is yet anther egregious instance of Hendrickson splicing bits of conversations together (this is not "manipulation" as he calls it, it is downright out of order, in every sense, there is a difference);
but still, this argues that's what he believed had happened and he was close to them;
therefore, I believe Zero died, probably on acid, (which it appears from some recent stuff I read, is eliminated very fast from bloodstream and doesn't show on autopsies), in the way Sadie described, at the moment of climax, with Country Sue.
This would explain the whole Russian Roulette with a full gun stuff, since Sue is not likely to tell the police the truth, especially since she would be an accessory to suicide or something. Anyway, it's kind of a weird thing to tell the cops, especially if you're a new girl, not an inured old hand. She was doubtless embarrassed.
Why didnt the cops investigate further? because they didnt care. "We got so many murders now" as the cop n HS says. There were killings aplenty all over the hippie world. "No-one was surprised" said Joan Didion, when Sharon was killed.
Fiona, even in 1969 you would be able to tell if someone died from a drug overdose and then was shot afterwards after performing the autopsy. The LAPD was lazy and non-commited, not the medical examiners
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