Saturday, March 04, 2006

The Big Burn


So follow the bouncing ball....
Tex Watson and his chick Rosina Kroner plot to rip off 5 grand in weed from a well known black drug dealer.
(I've been to his house on Woodrow Wilson-there is no way this buidling was anything but happening even thirty five years ago. So he was obviously a dealer to some big people.)
Not sure if Rosina is in on it or not.
Tes DRIVES with Crowe/Lotsapoppa (who by the way, from photos I've been able to find is not that tall and not all that fat) to a building in Hollywood where he leaves Rosina in the car, takes the drugs inside to get the money, then walks out the back and disappears.
Now maybe Charlie did send him to do this. Charlie certainly picks up the mess aftrewards.
We'll get to that even some day.
But- Crowe was a big playa. He dealt drugs to Dennis Wilson (yup) and others in the Holly Hood.
The Col is beginning to think that CROWE and the drug burn (which comes within a week of both Hinman and TLB) is the missing link that needs to be examined closer.
Is the cold messing my thoughts up?

65 comments:

nellieoleson said...

col,
hinman had been planning to go to japan, hinman gave charlie some mda that he got from Frykowski the bikers thought it was a burn and wanted there money back, thats why they went to hinmans house to make it good, it is all conected back to Frykowski and abigail folger

catscradle77 said...

Thank you Col..ever come to my neck of da weoods I'll buy ya the best drink ever...whatever your poison is..

catscradle77 said...

Ummmm..didn't Rosina get taken hostgae by Lotsappa and his crew cuz Tex fled, leaving her there...and that is why (or at least it is said) that Manson came back and "handled" bizness..

ColScott said...

Nellie
No
Hinman gave the MDMA to BOBBY
The bikers then claimed it was no good
Who knows if it was good or they were looking to take advantage.
Anyway this is a Crowe posting.
Cradle- yes that is true.

Audio Magic said...

Were the bikers involved actually Hells Angels? Because in one interview with Tom Snyder, Manson says that there was some stuff going on with the "Hells Angels" that "you don't even want to know about"...then of course he gets interrupted by Tom Snyder and there goes that thought out the window

Heaven said...

I agree with you completely, I think it deserves a closer look...

=)

nellieoleson said...

zappa moved from the log cabin to a house on Woodrow Wilson,charlie thought that that lottapappa was a panther
and had lookouts at spahn watching for them after charlie shot lottapappa

catscradle77 said...

Was the Snyder interview after the incident with the Angels and the Stones? I have the flu and my typing and brain are fuzzy..cuz that's what the comment couldda meant...the whole Snyder interview was kinda fun to watch..Snyder made a flaming jackass outta himself pre Geraldo jackass...

agnostic monk said...

I always thought it was really weird that Tex would leave Rosina in the car and check out the back to disappear. They were broken up by then, weren't they? So maybe he was trying to screw her as well.

What did Tex think Lottsa was gonna do to her once he realized he was being taken? Come out and offer her some ice tea?

catscradle77 said...

Why take Rosina with him? Any word on who Rosina is besides Tex's whatever? Why did Tex flee out the backdoor, leaving her in the car? (cuz he is wuss is not an answer)Why, when whoever went to the car, without Tex-didnt she flee and get help? (gun the engine sisterhood and get the hell out of there)Why did the calls to the Ranch ask for "Charlie"-isnt that how Manson got on the phone? Dunno if TEx was ever called Charlie...hmpffff

agnostic monk said...

"gun the engine sisterhood"

LOL!!!!!!

Heaven said...

According to Tex (if you chose to believe him) everyone involved agree that if any problems came up, Manson would handle it...

That's why Charlie handled the phone calls.. Then, went and saw Crowe...

According to Tex, the buckskin jacket Manson was wearing when he was arrested in October, came from one of the guys standing there when Charlie shot Crowe...

catscradle77 said...

drinking my iced tea-thanks monk..lol
Okay-according to the Tex book, from what my fevered brain can comprehend, he calls Rosina Luella, and states she was a girlfriend of a friend of his...thats how he knows her..that they got together (he wasnt on the Ranch-he had left??) and had dealt drugs together..he goes back to the Ranch..talks of some big score and lies to Luella/Rosina and drags her back into the mix speaking of big quick money, think they need money...so Rosina/Luella (makes me wanna go Rosanna Rosanna Danna Banana Cream Pie) so Rosina knows Crowe...they all pile into a vehicle to go to score da drugs...Tex says he has got to go alone or it will be suspicious...so everyone but Tex sits in the car...and then he flees...
Phew-need tylenol...

catscradle77 said...

Okay-Tex says in is book, he lied to Luella and said that "his Mafia vending machine connection" would only sell 25 kilos so thats how Crowe camew into it...

nellieoleson said...

remember charlie brought tj with him after the burn to meet with pappa and tj left soon after to go back home

Audio Magic said...

catscradle77 said...
Was the Snyder interview after the incident with the Angels and the Stones? I have the flu and my typing and brain are fuzzy..cuz that's what the comment couldda meant...the whole Snyder interview was kinda fun to watch..Snyder made a flaming jackass outta himself pre Geraldo jackass...

12:12 PM

The Tom Snyder interview took place in the early 1980's I believe.

Heaven said...

Monk is correct, 1981 in fact..

I liked how each time Manson attempted to go off in his usual rambling way, Tom would bring him back on the subject...

=)

catscradle77 said...

Thanks Audio..

Okay...so far Tex deals drugs with Rosina...set Crowe up..Tex bows out back door (of whose apartment-anyone know???) Rosina calls Ranch..Manson and TJ go to her rescue..while there, shoot Crowe in front of one Bryn Lukashevsky, a friend of Dennis Wilson...who then tells Wilson who tell Jakobson who tells Melcher..poof goes any chance of recording contract..why was Dennis' friend at a hostile situation at Rosina's apartment with one Mr. Crowe...
Someone help me...my head hurts...lol

catscradle77 said...

Wow-the 80's..thanks Heaven too...seemed earlier...
At points though..Charlie was getting somewhere in his Charlie like manner....and then Snyder would go off...

Heaven said...

For those that have never seen the interview, you can read it here...

http://www.charliemanson.com/tom-snyder-1981.htm

=)

catscradle77 said...

I think I saw an uncut version of that interview that isnt all chopped up..I will have to dig thru my collection..

60skid said...
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60skid said...
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Audio Magic said...

Here is where CM talks about the Hells Angels in the TS interview. (Colors mean gangs..different gangs have different colors to this day.) I don't remember VB ever mentioning the HA's in his book but talked about The Straight Satans. He may have, it's just been so long since I read HS. I wondered if it was the HA's that thought they got burned, or decided to hassel BB, Tex or anyone else ovver the MDA. If so, then at least back then they were a very scarey bunch to piss off.


Manson:...... I was playing with some Hell’s Angels that you don’t know nothing about and you probably never will know nothing about it. Because you would have to know those people to get in that thought, see. But there’s different colors on different peoples backs doing different things. It’s a different world. I love the world I live in too just like Reagan loves the world he lives in.

nellieoleson said...

in 68-69 other then the straight satans there was the wanabee bikers the gypsy jokers wearing colors and being on the strip and hollywood

60skid said...
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nellieoleson said...

the gypsy jokers were in hollywood and la then in 68-69

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Heaven said...

I've never heard of any connection between Manson and Hells Angels..
It doesn't mean that a connection never existed, I've just never heard of it...

Charlie was pretty "small time", in the big scheme of things...
Like a little fish in a really big pond.

There could be any number of reasons why the Labianca's were picked, the least of them being random...

I'm wondering why the police made the little black book completely disappear. That has me wondering if maybe it wasn't an inside thing...

Leno had big debts. Like the Col said, big debts, big names...

Manson is the only person who knows why, and he ain't talking...

I'm personally ruling out drugs cause none was found anywhere in the home. I've known enough drug runners in my life to know addicts have stashes everywhere...
Not even a marijuana seed was found... But, on the other hand, maybe Rosemary/Suzan dealt but didn't use. Odd, but possible...

I think this was about money.. maybe big money....

But, what if we're all wrong and they were indeed random?

There seems to be nothing concrete to go on.. So, what if Manson was just touring a familiar neighborhood?....

I doubt it, but with him, anything's possible. I can't even begin to wager true motive on the Labianca's....

But then I come back to Rosemary having a wig shop, a Mexico connection.. Tex had a wig shop, Mexico connection...

Makes ya wonder if the two ever crossed paths....

So many questions, very few answers....

60skid said...
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Audio Magic said...

All I know is what I have read and learned on the History Channel, etc... over the years about the Hells Angels is that they were formed after WW2, by fighter pilots who loved the adrenaline rush of flying planes and they could get that same rush from bikes like Harley's. Then as time passed the HA's began to become corrupt and started working along with the Mob, dealing Meth in the 1960's...Now, I know Charlie did meth in the 50's-- lots of people did, but now it was becoming a very lucrative business and the drug of choice towards the end of the 1960's. (I'm not going to even try to connect Leno to this, because I wouldn't know) but I know that CM said that about the HA's. IMO, this entire crime looked, at least in part, speed-fueled to me. If you've ever seen anyone strung out on meth you'd know what I mean. Some of the most horrifying crimes I've ever heard about had speed involved. California, specifically San Diego had the dubious distinction of being the Meth captial of the world a decade or so ago, but it took time to get that kind of reputation. To this day Meth is the worst drug on the Planet. I wonder if Tex, and others were tweaking, selling and buying it.

(Has anyone else ever watched the HA's and the mob connection on the History channel?)

Salem said...

hinman had been planning to go to japan, hinman gave charlie some mda that he got from Frykowski the bikers thought it was a burn and wanted there money back, thats why they went to hinmans house to make it good, it is all conected back to Frykowski and abigail folger

************
i have heard this also.

Salem said...

Audio Magic said...
Were the bikers involved actually Hells Angels? Because in one interview with Tom Snyder, Manson says that there was some stuff going on with the "Hells Angels" that "you don't even want to know about"...then of course he gets interrupted by Tom Snyder and there goes that thought out the window
yes
the HA wre at the ranch at times... mostly for drugs.not sex.

Heaven said...

I know the SS were at the ranch, but I hadn't heard anything confirming the HA was too.. I had just heard rumors.. And you know how rumors are...

=)

closed blog said...
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Heaven said...

"Manson may be crazy, but he's not stupid."

Very true!

60skid said...
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Salem said...

I know the SS were at the ranch, but I hadn't heard anything confirming the HA was too.. I had just heard rumors.. And you know how rumors are...

WELL
THE HA WERE THERE!!
ASK UNCLE JACK, he met them
he liked cm. said the girls skankey!

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nellieoleson said...

if the angels ever saw a gypsy joker wearing colors they would take em from them, the gypsy jokers were scared of the angels

Salem said...

catscradle77 said...
Okay-Tex says in is book, he lied to Luella and said that "his Mafia vending machine connection" would only sell 25 kilos so thats how Crowe camew into it...

thanks Cat:)

Salem said...

savage national socialist said...
Salem said:
>he liked cm.the girls skankey!<

He thought the girls were skanks?

lol, maybe a little soap and water would have done wonders but what made the old buzzard think he was getting any?

He and pals were there for drugs ( speed mainly) cm threw in some *buttons* for the wait they had, some of the girls came on to Jack, she said he turned them down!!! That they were nasty.
Jack made comments after the murders, he could NOT believe that Little dude up there had anything to do with it. in his words, * that lil dude was crazy as hell but murder? Hell NO.... Man when the murders went down, we all thought WTF?*

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Salem said...

lol, ya gotta say one thing about charlie, he knew how to entertain guests :-)

YES
WE AGREE ON THAT.HE WAS A SOUTHERN BOY AND AND SOUTHERN PEOPLE ARE KNOWN FOR HOSPITALITY.
AND DONT GET ME WRONG, I AM NOT A MANSON LOVER, I KNOW HE DID ALOT OF BAD THINGS,HE DID STEAL AND HE DID PIMP OUT GIRLS AND SOLD DRUGS, HE DID WHAT HE KNEW TO DO AS A KID, ( HIS FAMILY BACK GROUND AS U MIGHT SAY) HE FOLLOWED IN HIS MOM AND UNCLE LUTHERS FOOTSTEPS.
BUT AS A LITTLE CHILD, HIS LIFE WAS A LIVING HELL. I FEEL SORRY FOR THE CHILD THATS INSIDE CHARLES MANSON.
AND HIS RECORD IN PRISON IS BAD.BUT I LIKE HIM , WOULD RATHER BE IN *THE HOLE* THAN OUT WITH THE GANGS THERE WHERE HE IS.
HE HAS NEVER WAVERED ON HIS ACCOUNT OF WHAT HAPPENED. AND HE DOES KNOW, BUT HE IS NOT A SNITCH, HE WILL TELL YOU HE NEVER KILLED ANYONE. AND I BELEIVE HIM.

Salem said...

To this day Meth is the worst drug on the Planet. I wonder if Tex, and others were tweaking, selling and buying it.

AUDIO

CM HAS SAID HE MOVED SADIE AND TEX AWAY TO THE FAR END OF THE RANCH AS THEY HAD STARTED THIER OWN LITTLE THING* AND WERE BRINGING TOO MANY UNWANTED TYPES TO THE RANCH.
WHEN SANDY FOUND SPAHN'S FOR THEM TO STAY, SHE SAID SHE NEVER THOUGHT IT WOULD TURN OUT THE WAY IT DID. ALSO SANDY AND LYNN WERE NEVER BIG DRUG USERS.
RED AND BLUE STAYED IN THE PARACHUTE ROOM. RED LOOKED AFTER THE CHILDREN MOSTLY AND CARED FOR GEORGE.

Salem said...

CAT

CHEERS
SAME HERE;)

catscradle77 said...
Thank you Col..ever come to my neck of da weoods I'll buy ya the best drink ever...whatever your poison is..

MIGHTY GOOD MOONSHINE BREWS HERE STILL TO THIS DAY.

Salem said...

HEAVEN SAYS
Leno had big debts. Like the Col said, big debts, big names...

there was some one out there that wanted that lil black book .
who pointed it out to tex or Charles? a pal from prison or a pal from the MOB?

catscradle77 said...

Wasn't Charlie in prison with some old mobsters? Or was it a book containing connections in the drug world?
How does one make that much money selling wigs???? I think I am in the wrong profession...unless the black book was just a topic for distraction like the glasses at the Tate's..and the motive was some kind of drug burn, between Tex, Suzan and the reason for the falling out between Rosemary and her daughter..why didnt Suzan or Frank start screaming "where's me Mum" after Joe and Frank Jr found Leno? It is apparent that the discovery of Rosemary was a shock to the cops...and why was she wearing the dress over her other clothes? Didnt drug dealers often wear two sets of clothes to ditch one in case of cop trouble???

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Yepyep said...
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Audio Magic said...

Just my thoughts about the black book...
Maybe it had some high profile names in it. Maybe hot shot celebrities, dirty cops, and grocery store chain owners? Maybe it was booked into evidence but it got in the way of Bugliosi's strategy, and he didn't want the contents of it known. So he made it disappear along with anything else that could've blown the top off of the Hollywood elite's not so pure lifestyle, and drug dealers like Fry, and others. Bigger names than Frykowski were dealing drugs back then.

60skid said...
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Richard Judd said...

Wow this convo is old I don't know if this will even get noticed. I just found out about Tex' mobster drug connect who used a vending machine business as a front. I know who that was. That was Joel Rostau's partner Eugene Massaro. I foia'd his FBI file and he lived a stones throw away from Tex and his girlfriend and ran a vending machine business and dealt in narcotics. His FBI file is on Scribd for anyone who wants to read it.