Wednesday, June 15, 2011

Some People Cannot Read


In the comments one reader, Mr. Poirot (probably not a Belgian detective) writes the following rant.

Blogger MrPoirot said...

Col you have spent years trying to create your unique version of TLB. You think Tate was a drug burn retaliation and Labianca was a mob hit by Charlie. Sorry but I've never heard any of the killers back up your versions. Ive spent a lot of time reading your versions over the past 5 years. I really can't see why you make claims that are never once backed up by any of the killers or Family members. I really don't give a rats ass if Bug ever existed or not. You know darn well that Charlir flipped his lid after Bobby, Mary and Sandy ended up in jail only s few days after he thought he had murdered Crowe. Within minutes of this triple jailing dilema on the day Charlie got back from Easelen Inst Charlie and the girls concocted the copycat murder spree of TLB in order to get Bobby off. I believe you know this to be the case yet you continually try to write your own script that has nothing to do with the events that are backed up by every person involved. Not a single Family member has ever substantiated your claims even after over 40 years. Not one person ever testified about a mob hit or drug burn in any of the many murder trials that lasted nearly 9 years. Most of these trials Bug was not involved with.

There are so many problems in this statement that after a while I get so frustrated I cannot take it sometimes. The fucking guy says he has read the blog but he obviously cannot read then very well. Because he is just factually incorrect about so much shit. Sorry Poirot, but you do in fact deserve this public lashing.

Blogger MrPoirot said...

Col you have spent years trying to create your unique version of TLB.Sir I am not trying to create anything. I don't have any version. I am trying to make sense out of things that are lies upon lies upon lies. I do not think I have succeeded, despite a 34 year obsession with the case. The Col NEVER says he is right because he knows he is not. I do not have a unique version of the events I examine EVERY version of events. You think Tate was a drug burn retaliation No I do not. In recent posts we are exploring that. This is one possible scenario. There are many others.and Labianca was a mob hit by Charlie. Fuck you dickhead for putting words in my mouth. I have never said this. I find this highly unlikely. It is a theory and so we explore it. But if you can't read then don't write.Sorry but I've never heard any of the killers back up your versions. Because the killers all tell the truth? Retard. Many of them testified that it was all about Helter Skelter. That is one thing that I am certain it was NOT about.Ive spent a lot of time reading your versions over the past 5 years.Only not very well I really can't see why you make claims that are never once backed up by any of the killersThe Killers all say Charlie made them do it. This is ludicrous. or Family members.Maybe I should believe Little Paul's testimony. After all, he only wanted to take the whole Family over, why would he lie about Charlie, right? I really don't give a rats ass if Bug ever existed or not. What does this mean? More retardation. He always existed. WHY did he make up a motive and suppress evidence and perjure himself? Insanity? (much evidence for this) Arrogance? (more evidence for this!) Cover Up (I don't know but would like to. You know darn well that Charlir flipped his lid after Bobby, Mary and Sandy ended up in jail only s few days after he thought he had murdered Crowe. Within minutes of this triple jailing dilema on the day Charlie got back from Easelen Inst Charlie and the girls concocted the copycat murder spree of TLB in order to get Bobby off.First off, I don't darn well know anything. Second off, this is a good solid theory. Like all theories there are major holes. Firstly, no one in authority EVER thought they were copycats- were they just super lame? And secondly, why stop? Why 2 and not 4 nights? Or 8? I believe you know this to be the caseI know nothing, which is one hundred times more than you do. yet you continually try to write your own script that has nothing to do with the events that are backed up by every person involved.The majority of testimony is about Helter Skelter, idiot, not copycats- so your own paragraph is contradictory bullshit. Not a single Family member has ever substantiated your claims even after over 40 years.And again, I guess Tex and Bruce are telling us the truth, right? Not one person ever testified about a mob hitagain, NEVER said this nor do I believe it or drug burn in any of the many murder trials that lasted nearly 9 years. Most of these trials Bug was not involved with.Most of them he was involved in actually.

So there we have it. One of the reasons this is too hard. People refuse to actually read properly.

49 comments:

MrPoirot said...
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FrankM said...

Mon cher Hercule

You are accusing Col of making claims he has not made. In any case, both of these (black book, victims were involved in criminal activity) are hypotheses that have long been in the TLB literature, and have no special relation to him. Col is revisiting these these areas, and why not?

Far worse, you write with a certainty you cannot have ('They did no such thing'). Surely you are aware of the impossibility of proving that something did not happen.

Neither of these are useful.

FrankM

ColScott said...

Poirot- You are an asshole who keeps stating something that is not true. I have no black book theory and I never mentioned it, it is only in the comments.
Frykowski, LaBianca and Sebring for sure committed criminal acts. Did this cause their murders. I don't know but I want to.
You should really go away like scramblehead said- anything you say going forward will be colored by the fact that you are retarded.

MrPoirot said...
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adam said...

The only major player in the family that I know of who thinks that TLB were copycat murders to help free Bobby is Sandy and we all know what a fruit loop she is.....

Any claims the girls made on the stand was carried out in an attempt to try blame Linda as the instigator of the crimes due to being in love with Bobby(and thus deflect the "Charlie brainwashed them to commit Helter Skelter" charges being levelled at him). Gypsy, Sadie etc have all later admitted that they lied about this.

starship said...

I'm surprised that MrPoirot seems to believe in the HS theory. I've found from his posts on here and other blogs that he knows a great deal of the details of the case and so I have respect for him for that.

That said I take every opportunity to state the following:

MrPoirot, if you think that at least nine people were murdered in Los Angeles in 1969 because of the Book of Revelation combined with the fact that the Beatles wrote a song about a slide in an amusement park, then you are indeed mistaken.

Crash said...

great blog Col. Thank you. The way I see it is if someone accepts the helter skelter theory as a motive, they havent done enough research. That simple.

adam said...

You can take any of the theories behind TLB floating around and poke holes in their reasoning, but the only two that defy all logical thinking given what we know are the HS theory and the 'Charlie was mad at the world because he didn't become a pop star' one. The two the Bug spouts to anyone that will listen to him!

sportspro511 said...

If anyone actually believes Smugliosi's Helter Skelter theory then they seriously need a reality check. Of course all the killers are going to blame it all on Charlie, it helps their chances of parole. It makes them look better if they blame it on Charlie. While I don't believe Charlie is innocent, there is no way his stupid Helter Skelter theory was why the murders took place. Why did Tex and Company only stop at one house on Cielo Drive? Why not other houses. Why only two nights? The Colonel isn't saying his certain theories are definitely the reason why the people were killed, he's saying they COULD BE possibilities. The Colonel is trying to find the truth in a case so heavily filled with lies, mostly coming from Smugliosi.

MrPoirot said...
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starship said...

Ummm, ok. Then what did?

Don't tell us what you don't know, tell us what you know...or at least what you think you know.

And sorry, MrPoirot, but your claim that Frykowski and Sebring weren't involved in criminal acts is just laughable.

sportspro511 said...

It is well known that Sebring and Frykowski were very much involved in the Hollywood drug scene in the 60's. They weren't choir boys, they most likely committed some sort of criminal acts. I'm not saying that they were cold hearted felons or that they deserved what they got, but when you do blow you're most likely to get mixed in with some bad people

MrPoirot said...
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Marliese said...

Mr. Poirot said...The selection of the victims in TLB was random and of no consequence to the attackers. They cared not who lived in either house. The selection of the houses the victims resided in was deliberate. The Manson Cult was staging copycat killings simulating the scene at Gary Hinman's house. Their goal was to mislead law enforcenent into thinking Beausoleil was not the murderer of Hinman.



In your humble opinion...

Vera Dreiser said...

Poirot: "The Manson Cult was staging copycat killings simulating the scene at Gary Hinman's house. Their goal was to mislead law enforcement into thinking Beausoleil was not the murderer of Hinman."

If they really wanted to make the world think it was a copycat then why, as someone else pointed out here, did they not write or call the press anonymously? You don't think the press woulda jumped on it? You think they were smart and savvy enough to stage copycats but not smart enough to realize it hadn't been figured out by the cops, and then go to the media? And of course, if it were "Helter Skelter" it wouldn't have stopped at LaBiancas.
The three other violent crimes the group was involved with that month -- Crowe, Hinman & Shea -- were drug/robbery/conceal (Shorty) related, why does it appear so inarguable that Tate & LaB were just to free Bobby and/or start "HS"?
I believe they were absolutely targeted with a motive that still remains unknown. In that sense, I agree with the Good King Col.
Don't you think the uncensored Susan Atkins would have said something re: the copy cat to Howard or Graham? She certainly talked about everything else.

And I'm still waitin' on Scram-Head's answers to my Black Book questions. You listening, Scram?

starship said...

MrPoirot,

You know who Joel Rostau is, I trust?

rfoster1 said...

*g r o a n* ya'll are giving me a headache.

MrPoirot said...
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sbuch113 said...

If the plan was to copy the Hinman murder, why not "copy" his murder?

Like, find another hippie type guy with little income, living in one of the canyons in a older style home.
Then slash the guys face, stab him in the heart, write POLITICAL PIGGY in blood on the wall and steal his car.
Oh........don't forget the "Panther Paw" print.

candy and nuts said...

This Mr P once brought up if AC X'ed her head and I wrote well I have and he decided I may have X but didnt swastika because I lost belive in Charlies thoughts and continued to send me a big long email about it ( I gave him my email I said dont use up the whole blog here with yur theories of what "I" did or didnt do~ I think this guy has some need to claim to be the expert of everything to do with TLB Manson etc I at first wondered who this guy is but then I thought he has to be noone why give a shit his theories he will just jump from one blog to the other telling everyone they are wrong and he is right-D-bag

wharf rat said...

Mr P,

The comments you have left show that you have certainly read up on TLB murders. other comments on other related blogs have shown you to be anti semitic, a dumb shit, or just an asshole("Mel Gibson will never get another job because u no who won't let him" let me guess the JEWS) ("n Bernie Madoff caused the fall of the economy")

I won't even go into the racist
("obamagambo that's why I lost my job" not the GOP led economy of 2001-2006)

I am sure you have not been collecting unemployment while you sit on your computer telling everyone how clever you are.
You would be a socialist then!

I will not even start with your comments on the 60's.

Segregation isn't returning. Get over it DOUCHEBAG!

candy and nuts said...

I second the D bag comment this Mr p is now posting on eveil liz blog how paul croclket charged $100 hour for something shit I thought this Mr P just stuck his fkn nose in at me I guess he is fair and balanced he sticks his nose in everything

candy and nuts said...

mr p stick his nose in about mel gibson etc omg maybe this is monkeyboy jim richardson now in another new name wahahahahahah

MrPoirot said...
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adam said...

Erm,
Drug burn - Frykowski may or may not have ripped Tex off on a drug deal and Tex killed him (and anybody else who happend to be in the house) over it.

Black book - Leno may or may not have had some dodgy dealings with the mob and he and his wife ended up getting killed because of it. I doubt this was the motive but lets face it, we are all shooting in the dark on this one - plus, the Labianca's fiances (Leno's gambling debts and/or Rosemary having a shitload of money that can't be adequately acounted for)certainly suggest something iffy was going on.

And the Col did try to explain how these could be the motives and you fucking shit all over him for doing so.

Shak El said...

Has anyone stopped and considered that maybe its all caused by White Rabbit....just kidding but I heard someone is writing a book on this case in which WR is the killer.

MrPoirot said...
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Scramblehead said...

Mr. Poirot,

You were ordered to LEAVE.

Get out and don't come back!

I advise everyone here to simply IGNORE any further comments from the BUG's little bitch.

It's a waste of your time and the Col's as well as a waste of web space.

The conversation will go NOWHERE other than him repeating the same robotic lowest-common-denominator mainstream rhetoric.

Just ignore him and he will go away.

MrPoirot said...
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adam said...

MrPoirot why are you even posting on this blog if you apparently know everything that went down on those nights? Why waste your time on a blog site when you could be writing the definative TLB bestseller?

Vera Dreiser said...

Scram? Black book?

Scramblehead said...

Miss Vera,

This isn't the place to reveal the specifics. If we were in person, getting a cup of coffee or something, I'd gladly tell you.

I'd tell you to email me if you are genuinely curious, but I know better than to post my email here for all the world to see.

I have no reason to fabricate. Just stating the facts as they exist in my personal experiences. Take it or leave it.

Been researching the case since '94 - after seeing the pilot episode of "Turning Point."

candy and nuts said...

Mr P it isnt just the Col comments you tend to act high and mighty to everyone on every blog you creep into ( as you did with me seeming to "know" the rationale and motivations for my actions pertaingin to an X) as someone posted earlier if you are so in the know on everything about this case and everyone ( including me since you already told me my motivations ie the X) write a book

MrPoirot said...
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Vera Dreiser said...

Scramblehead: "Miss Vera, This isn't the place to reveal the specifics."

Well, I think the Col might disagree with you 'bout that.
Anyhow, here's the thing, the two most disreputable people in the Manson saga are the sources of the "black book" mystery -- Charles and the late Bill "Nellie" Nelson.
Manson started talking about it in the '90's and then Nelson got Alice LaBianca to confide that she found a black book at the LaB house while cleaning it after the murders, then gave it to Patchett. If you read Nellie's classic tome, MANSON: BEHIND THE SCENES, you'll see Alice told Nellie that she "didn't remember what was in" the black book but that she "believed it belonged to Rosemary."
Nelson then jumped to the conclusion that the book must contain the names of the mobsters and drug contacts that Manson was talking about. He makes the typically Nelliesque leap-of-logic that because Rosemary HAD a black book, it means Manson was telling the truth. As he wrote (warbled): "The fact that Manson says he asked for a black book and that Alice says there was one found after the killings, takes away the possibility that Manson was only making the conversation up."
Now Scram-Head, dear, you may be too young to recall the days before computers and cell phones, but in 1969 EVERYONE had little black books! I still have mine from way-back-when in storage boxes.
Because Rosemary had a black book means nothing.
If Patchett took it from Alice it should be in evidence, and because his wife shooshed Nellie away when he showed up at her door asking for it in 1994 means nothing. (Were you with him?). Oh, and my fave passage in the book occurs in that section. When Mrs. Patchett "put her hand on her chest and inquired, 'How did you find us?'" Nellie replied, "Well, I cannot tell you that, but I can tell you that I'm blessed in what I do" (is that what he said to the little girls before diving into their undergarments?).

louis365 said...

The Col is also insane MrPoirot

Scramblehead said...

Miss Vera,

If the little black book was mundane and insignificant, I doubt Patchett (remember the RFK connection) would've been inspired to STEAL and CONCEAL it.

I also knew Nelson and didn't take his word for anything - I did my own follow up.

Manson has admitted who he is on a number of occasions. He has never TRIED to get out of prison (unlike all the others). He has no reason to lie but he does have a reason to omit. It's called SURVIVAL.

The LaBianca's were not a random hit. Cielo was not a random hit. Hinman was not random, nor was it a hit - remember they were at his house for a few days (they didn't go there to kill him).

It's a mystery and it is solvable.

Listen closely to those who seek no forgiveness, for they are usually the most honest.

adam said...

Scramblehead said
The LaBianca's were not a random hit. Cielo was not a random hit. Hinman was not random, nor was it a hit - remember they were at his house for a few days (they didn't go there to kill him).

Evidence?

Vera Dreiser said...

Scram-Head: "Listen closely to those who seek no forgiveness, for they are usually the most honest."

Ok, I'll give you that. Very valid point.

slow said...

Ok, so isn't the point of this blog to get to the truth? It has been so far. I like the discussions and arguments but I am not sure why it has to be made personal. The Col. has given us an open forum to discuss theories and hopefully unknown facts. Making personal attacks just gets in the way of what we are all here for. I think we should post a list of causes, facts, theories, and lies. Personal experiences I think could also give a good insight. For example: Why not ask someone who does acid 10 times a day how they think. What if you were a guy that liked music, did acid all day, had sex whenever they wanted, questioned the world and then thought they found someone to give them the answers? What state of mind would you be in then? On the other hand, how would it be different if you were a girl. Would you think any differently then the guy? Why did this group act differently then other hippie families of the time? There had to an event that triggered this. Besides the murders, what makes this group so different?
If you have something to enhance our thinking, add it, if not, start your own blog.

MrPoirot said...
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MrPoirot said...
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ColScott said...

Mr Poirot
You have appeared here and spouted needless lies and venom. Why I would eat with you I cannot fathom.
Vera
I find Scramble frustrating at times but I know who he is. What he says he believes based on evidence. He knew Nelson well and loathed him- he knew Rudi and others very well indeed.

MrPoirot said...
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MrPoirot said...
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candy and nuts said...

Mr P anyone who begs this bad for attention is shameless -there is one response to someone like you-"get a life"- this is an internet discussion blog so please dont sit up day and night dwelling on it` go outside enjoy the summer dont sit up until 2 am thinking up your next post-your OCD is showing itself badly~ now stop embaressing yourself

ColScott said...

Mr Poirot
I never posted Liz's address. Again you are stupid and a liar. I wash my hands of your stupidity.

candy and nuts said...

Mr P as proven on evilliz blog you said that photo of Charlie with a miner was Paul crockett-which everyone knows it was not-proving you again are wrong about many things, details even as slight as this photo show you dont know everything ( HELLO) . it was nice seeing you were wrong (again )give me a good chuckle that day :)

grimtraveller said...

Crash said...

"The way I see it is if someone accepts the helter skelter theory as a motive, they havent done enough research. That simple"


Not at all true. I've done extensive research and continue to do so. I'm fascinated by so many aspects of this case....but I've yet to find anything that shunts aside HS as one of the motives. Most people do not look deeply into the conglomerate that makes up HS. Furthermore, it was only ever presented as one of the motives. The way virtually every helter sceptic speaks, you'd think it was the only motive spoken of by the prosecution.